Release

Once again you lose me. 99.5 % of golfers play above scratch. The average handicap is ~ 16 to 18. It has nothing to do with how much they practice. It's simply a hard game to play and get consistently good at. In order to be a scratch player (in addition to scoring criteria) you need to be able to drive the ball 250 yards and reach a 470 yard par 4 in two shots. And you can practice and train all you want, but your ability to swing the club fast is determined my birth. Unfortunately we have no say in that. The numbers don't lie. People are not getting any better at this game and have not for many years.

Golf has a uniqueness to it unlike any other sport. Golfers will find a key and think they've finally got it. Only to find out that (that) epiphany was fleeting. Then that epiphany search begins all anew. This happens at all levels of golf.

I remember Lee Westwood when he was struggling saying he would spend hours on the range and he was hitting it worse at the end of the session than when he began. And we need to look no further than the best player in the last 20 years to show how fast you can lose it.

I'm playing to a 9.9 handicap right now (11 home course par 71). Normally shoot low - mid 80s and if I'm on mid to upper 70's. I cannot practice anymore due to chronically bad elbows. Use to be a huge range rat. Loved practicing and trying to get better.

What I've found confirms what I've read. After playing for ~ 3 years you'll most likely reach your potential. I shoot the same scores today without any practice as when I could practice. And I mean I cannot even hit warmup balls before my round.

Anyway, we'll just have to agree to disagree on this subject. But I do believe the numbers along with physiology support my view. Maybe someday we can agree on something............

    It has nothing to do with philosophy.

    You didn't get it and you won't. It is what it is, just like the game of golf. One can talk and debate to death without agreement, just step up and show one's game . End of story.

    Once knew a kid whom could argue with the best and taunt a nice golf game with a single digit handicap index ( according to himself with the online index system - self reported scores ). One day he made a mistake by posting his golf swing on the forum. He'll be lucky to break 100 unless he could putt the golf ball in the cup from 100 yards out.
    Not saying you're like him, I'm sure you're solid as you state by yourself.

      Release

      Who said anything about Philosophy? The word I used is Physiology as it relates to the musculoskeletal system regarding fast and slow twitch muscles.

      "The musculoskeletal system is made up of the body's bones (the skeleton ), muscles , cartilage, tendons, ligaments, joints, and other connective tissue that supports and binds tissues and organs together. Its primary functions include supporting the body, allowing motion, and protecting vital organs."

      I agree let's end this story before it takes anymore bizarre turns. Ever heard the expression, a blind man in a room full of deaf people?

        Sneaky,

        Best for you to leave this thread if you only believe the information what you read and gathered without putting it to" practice" and experience.
        Any golfer including the opposite gender without obvious physical handicap or suffer from any ailment ( or old age ) could hit close to 250 yards drive with proper equipment and training. If the golfer wants to put in the dedication like training for an Olympic event. Yes, I read that article about "scratch" golfer also. It's not that simple to MAINTAIN a zero handicap or plus index.

        As for "philosophy", don't go back and change your post then contradict the original statement.

        Sorry I picked up your reply in my thread, thought to give you another chance . I was wrong.... this time for sure.

          Release

          I changed nothing. You misread physiology for philosophy. From my post. "Anyway, we'll just have to agree to disagree on this subject. But I do believe the numbers along with 'physiology' support my view."

          As for the rest of your post I have one word. Baloney. That 83 year old who you think hit it 275? You had no GPS and by you saying most people with training can hit it close to 250, now I know you're full of it. My guess is most golfers can't average 200 yards (including miss hits) let alone 250. No amount of training is going to get some one 50 yards.

          There's an old salt water fisherman expression where I come from when some one is full of it. They say your ass is sucking east wind. You're just not used to getting called out on your BS.
          Good night and good luck with your nonsensical threads / posts. I must learn not to engage with delusional thinking.

            Release

            I bet you'll be surprised when (if) you get there. It's not like you're going to go from 260-140 overnight. It will likely be a very gradual descent that you won't even really notice.

              Release

              The 83 year old should get hold of the Guinness Book of World Records, I'm pretty sure he'd be right near the record if there is one. I googled long drives by 80 year olds and couldn't come up with anything, but that's got to be in record territory.

                  garyt1957

                  My guess is the 83 year olds drives were 'slighty' exaggerated. And I use the word slightly very loosely. We have 3 guys in their 80's that still play in our group and their distance is way down from where they once were. One guy who is 85 is still as straight as ever, but can't hit an iron more than 125 - 130 yards tops. The key is to play off the appropriate tee for your distance.

                    garyt1957

                    Gary, Good to see you here.

                    Yes, and the 3rd senior whom plays senior tournament all over the country had made a comment at the back nine that he tried to catch up with the 83 year old's drive ( his own driving distance was close to 240-250, very long for someone over 70 ). It;s funny because I first noticed that the 3rd senior golfer tried harder and harder at his golf swing. Thought it was the effect of getting tired from walking the course, but he let it out on the 15th tee box telling the 83 that what in the world that he could not catch up with the 83's drive and he check the distance on several holes just to make sure it was not a fluke.

                    Come to think about it, not sure what's in the Vodka.

                    My memory of this 83 was when I walk up to the first tee and there he was sitting on the bench on the side of the tee box looking out to the green. Like a framed picture. Dressed appropriately like a golfer. I walked up and he looked around at me, I said " good morning, are you next up " ? He replied a simple "yes" and shook my hand , exchanged our first name politely. I than asked him where is his cart or golf clubs, he said casually, "oh, my partner took the golf cart and went back to the parking lot to get something ".......... A brief exchange .


                      Okay, in the back of my mind I thought maybe the someone had remembered his birthday wrong.

                      I was correct, the guy was not 83 but 81 years old. I confirmed this with several other golfers whom I hitched a round with the other day. Their 4th had back issue and I was walking on with the last minute decision.

                      So apparently, these 3 golfers played with the same guy in the past and one of them played college baseball one played college football, one played high school football. The one played the college baseball asked if I had played with the same guy there at the golf course, of course, I replied yes and shared our story.

                      His comment was, "okay , when he started playing well, I thought this will blow over soon but he kept coming up with pars and birdies and beat the crap out of us... later walked in the 19th hole and the bartender asked the 81 year old - the usual Mr......and he said sure and get my buddies a beer" as they walked in after the 81 year old.

                      So my mistake, the golfer is 81 instead of 83.

                      Well, my father is 83 and he can hit a driver about 230 or so. His 8-iron 150-ish. Still plays from the white tees. Routinely breaks 80. Had shot his age innumerable times.

                      I don't buy 275 from an 83-year-old, although it might be possible. But I think it is unlikely, since my father has got to be in the 99th percentile for 83-year-olds.

                        rsvman

                        After confirming with other golfers whom played with the guy often, his age was 81 , not 83.
                        During my round with him, maybe one or two tee shots close to 270 , majority were between 240-260 as one of us actually not only GPS but also paced off the distance.

                        Your father really is an inspiration to all of us. Quite frankly, I'm not even sure I could live to be his age let alone play golf like he does. You are one lucky son.