Spuzz

I mostly agree. Nick Price did the best he could with the players he had. They were simply outmatched in just about every category. But I wouldn't blame him for wanting nothing to do with this going forward. It has been a humbling experience for him, I'm sure.

And I also agree that the Golf Channel blowhards are putting the cart before the horse as it relates to Ryder Cup competition. We've won only 2 events going back to the 1995 Ryder Cup at Oak Hill, despite always having the strongest team statistically. Although, I must say, the Europeans are going through somewhat of a cyclic drought at the moment with very few proven players within their ranks.

I do think the future Ryder Cup events look promising for the US in the next few years, as the talented younger American players seem to have overcome the usual Ryder Cup precedence of experience over talent. I think this bodes well for the American team, as these younger American players seem to mesh well together... in a similar aspect as to those Europeans from recent years.

That said, anyone who has followed the Ryder Cup history over the past two decades understands that it's much more than talent. We have predominantly fielded the stronger teams (as individual players) over the past 20 years and we only have 2 successful Ryder Cup victories as a result.

It reminds us that it's not just about talent, but an attitude of an underdog that feels they have nothing to lose, and they tend to play like it, not as individuals - but as a team.

    Another "inside the ropes" perspective.
    https://psdontusetampons.com/2017/10/03/this-is-not-the-tour-i-know/?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=referral

    I agree with all of it. I had similar thoughts after I saw the post win media Q and A.
    It was cringeworthy, imo.
    Lots of gloating, immaturity and basic poor sportsmanship shown.
    They might be a great team, a talented team and a team of the future, but they will be hard to like outside of the US.
    Looking at it from my old school Canadian hockey background, if I was the International team the next time we played you, some of the US guys would be punched out on the first shift.
    JMO

      Thanks for the link, Spuzz. That was a well written blog.

      As luck would have it, I met, shook hands with, and spoke with Marc Leishman just yesterday morning. He seems like a truly nice man.

      She's within her rights to complain about some drunken obnoxious fans. Although, I would hope, she wouldn't paint all of the US fans with the same broad brush. It's usually just a handful of people, out of tens of thousands, who get boozed up and show their asses.

      But it just comes across as sour grapes when a tour player's wife takes to social media to call out his fellow playing opponents for being too fiercely competitive. I found her comments about Daniel Berger not only out of line, but also indicative of her husband's lackluster performance. Sorry, Audrey... if you can't take you husband getting lit up over four days of golf - maybe you'd be better off staying at home and also staying off the computer.

      I'm sure she's a remarkable lady, as is her husband... all they've been through the past few years indeed offers them a perspective that few of us could possibly relate to and both seem like classy people. And again - there is no place for boorish fan behavior, however small it might seem. They're not fans... they're drunken idiots who have no business being in attendance at a golf event of any sort.

      But this is a sporting arena, with winners and losers. And unfortunately (for the internationals) they didn't just lose, but they got f-ing trounced, and posting about it several days later doesn't change the outcome.

      No participation trophies handed out, unfortunately.

      PS - just do away with this godforsaken event already. It's not even competitive. I felt just as bad for the International team as she did. What's the point?

        PA-PLAYA But this is a sporting arena, with winners and losers. And unfortunately (for the internationals) they didn't just lose, but they got f-ing trounced

        While true, winning gracefully still counts and should count more in what's supposed to be a gentleman's game.
        As an example, waiting to concede a putt until the last minute in the last match on sat when things are about as good as done as it gets (and only because the crowd was acting like asses) is not the way to do it.

        In hockey, for example, when you are ahead by 7 in the 3rd period, and you score again, the old school way is to not make a big celebration out of it.
        I saw the opposite of that. It was somewhat disappointing to me and I think Miss Leishman was trying to convey that.

        I also agree that either the format changes, the criteria for picking players changes, or fire the whole contrived thing into the toilet.
        I personally don't care either way, I am just making Spuzzervations.
        😉

            PA-PLAYA it's definitely sour grapes....the things she complained about were minor....they got beat and beat soundly. That international team had plenty of firepower....it was not in any way a lame duck team talent wise but they ran into a buzz saw. The Americans hit a lot of great shots, and I think the word "great" before"shot" gets uttered way to much by golf announcers.

            And she has a problem with Berger's comments, lol, that's the kind of attitude that is needed in sport...nobody would question MJ if he said that....why not in golf?/!

            And Chamblee's comments, I'm pretty sure they were made prior to the Vegas tragedy, by a few days....and even if it was after, its a metaphor!

            Childish move to take it to social media!

              Spuzz

              I definitely agree about the prolonged deliberation on that conceded putt in the final match Saturday evening. That wasn't needed. And quite frankly I was disappointed that none of the captains there showed an ounce of competent awareness to understand the situation and direct Chappell/Hoffman to concede that putt. Quite frankly - I think Chappell and Hoffman made that decision themselves, without input from Stricker, Love or Furyk.

              Beyond that... it's a team sport. One should expect a fair degree of emotion, especially considering that a lot of those guys were playing in their first team event and were playing great golf (for the most part). Many of the Ryder Cups in the past hosted over in Europe have had similar degrees of emotion displayed by European players, despite enjoying a lopsided lead going into Sunday afternoon. Sergio and Poulter were always playing to their fans, and I never once thought anything negative of it.

              That's just part of team events... I agree there's a limit where it just gets gaudy and over the top, but I really didn't sense that our players reacted that much differently from the Europeans in the past.

              If I had to guess, Marc is probably wishing his wife didn't make this a huge issue. If the player's themselves aren't going to complain about it, then there's really no need for the wives/girlfriends to (as it relates to the players). As it relates to being heckled and mistreated by some drunken idiots, however - that is completely different. In fact - I wish more people would speak out about it. Even though it's only a handful of troublemakers, it's still too many imo.

                  PA-PLAYA Quite frankly - I think Chappell and Hoffman made that decision themselves,

                  I agree, but they didn't do it until the crowd started acting like jackasses, and that was only after they finished the hole first, leaving Lahiri in what was almost a Tony Jacklin position.
                  It was the right thing to do albeit a little on the late side.

                  On the course, I agree the players' behaviour wasn't too gaudy but the presser was, imo.

                  Not sure why she posted on social media, although it could be in part because her husband wouldn't and may have said things to her, either from his perspective or others, that she felt should be public.
                  Just a guess.

                    Well, Audrey was a little bit more 'diplomatic' than Danny Willet's brother Pete last year...😱
                    http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2016/09/29/pete-willett-ryder-cup-danny-willett-us-ryder-cup-team-europe-ryder-cup-team/

                    How many years has the American Ryder Cup team been criticized for being soft or playing with no enthusiasm or emotion? Another favorite opinion is the American PGA pro makes too much money so there is no incentive to get stoked for the Ryder Cup. Now we have a team that is much younger and obviously there is some pride in playing for Team USA and they have some swagger. I loved it.

                    I witnessed a couple of the International players 'shushing' the crowd after some great shots on the televised Prez Cup and they have to realize this invites (incites?) the partisons to make more noise. For the inebriated fans ruining the experience for other 'patrons', there should be little tolerance for rude and obnoxious behaviour whether it is a major, one of the International competitions, or even a weekly tour stop. Someone hit the nail on the head in another post in the past couple of weeks; they quit watching tv broadcasts because of the guys yelling after virtually every shot. In our new P.C. society in which we are supposed to be more tolerant, where do you draw the line on acceptible decorum outside the ropes?

                    I attended the Ryder Cup in Louisville and all I witnessed were fans behaving respectfully. I was really impressed with how the American fan was welcoming to the players and even the wild and crazies from across the pond both at the Opening Ceremonies and on the course. Do fans from varied parts of the country act differently and should 'hospitality' weigh more heavily in site selection for major / special tournaments?

                    Sorry to ramble - Audrey's rant rubbed me wrong but she said some things that needed to be brought to light.

                    I think it's probably a situation of a few bad apples , not that everyone there was being rude although the announcers did say more than once that it was a New York crowd. New Yorkers are unique fans I recall some issues last US open held at Bethpage

                    My good buddy was at the last Ryder Cup and said that there were quite a few fans that were being loud and a few saying rude and innapropriate things but it wasn't everyone. Perhaps we a just not used to that type of thing in the week to week golf we watch. If was hockey or football, lots of trash talk by Fans. We expect golf fans to be cordial .

                    These team type competitions where National pride is at stake are different. They always are more emotionally charged so I don't mind some boisterousness. Directing rude comments at a players wife ( if true) is offside.

                    Bergers comment is what I would expect the mind set of every player should be, let's kick their ass. I'm guessing it was taken a bit out of context or at an emotional moment. The US squad played great and if they need to be driven and emotional to win, they can do what they want. It seems to me that after all the criticisms of the team US committee that was convened after Tom Watsons debacle , that the US team is different . Yes they are very talented but there also seems to be a different mind set and team commoradery . This year was a mismatch, perhaps the biggest I can ever recall in recent Pres/Ryder Cups. It will be intersesting to see next RC , if this new US team attitude transaltes into a victory on enemy soil. They will be the favorite again.

                    Regarding the sportsmanship issue, not sure it was that bad. Again we want it to be friendly and gentlemanly , but nobody wants to lose, no matter what the overall score is. I just was watching Chicago beating Pittsburg 10-1 in hockey. This would never happen 30 years ago, the game would be littered with brawls and ejections if the score was ever run up. Things have changed. Put the pedal down and don't let up seems acceptable now.

                    Spuzz Another "inside the ropes" perspective.
                    https://psdontusetampons.com/2017/10/03/this-is-not-the-tour-i-know/?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=referral

                    I agree with all of it. I had similar thoughts after I saw the post win media Q and A.
                    It was cringeworthy, imo.
                    Lots of gloating, immaturity and basic poor sportsmanship shown.
                    They might be a great team, a talented team and a team of the future, but they will be hard to like outside of the US.
                    Looking at it from my old school Canadian hockey background, if I was the International team the next time we played you, some of the US guys would be punched out on the first shift.
                    JMO

                    My son-in-law called tonight and he is back from New York after spending a week at the President's Cup. He is very well CONNECTED and had access to dinners with the ex-presidents, VIP tents, and the players' hospitality suites. I specifically asked him about the sportsmanship between the Internationals and Americans. He said it is like family and they were giving each other crap (in a fun way) and they genuinely like each other.

                    He asked me why I would ask him that and I told him about Leishman's wife's op-ed piece. He was not aware of it and called it BS other than on course drunks and incidents he hadn't heard about. He recalls his chat with Marc after the competition Sunday and said he is a really nice guy. He was going to read her rant after we finished the call. He then on to tell me about the finale party Sunday night. The 2 teams took turns seranading
                    each other and he said the songs were hilarious and just a lot of good old fashioned comraderie. My daughter came down to drag him out of the party at 2:30 am because they had a plane to catch a few hours later.

                    I can't give a lot of other details or proof this is the relationship of the players but he did post a LOT of selfies with players and captains from both squads, and numerous celebs at the private events, on his Facebook account. My favorite picture was with my daughter and him taken with Dustin and Paulina Johnson. (Duh). I'm hoping he can pull his magic and get me some access in 4 years in N.C.

                    So, there IS another side and viewpoint of the story. Maybe someone put a burr on the golf cart seat Audrey had to ride on all day or some other agenda?

                      Something tells me that she's not familiar with how these team events get so fierce... was this Marc's first Presidents Cup? Didn't do my homework, but I think it might've been. But she never should've been mistreated, or made to feel like she wasn't welcome there by a few idiots in the galleries.

                      It's also worth noting (with no offense to my Northeast brethren) and perhaps this pertains more to the NY-based events than anything else - but there's a history with issues with a few fans there. Not just as it pertains to golf, but all sporting events. Bethpage has hosted two US Opens, and in both instances there were notable instances where a handful of unruly drunken fans had to be warned repeatedly and/or removed. It wasn't dealt with expediently and was allowed to fester to the point where the tournament marshalls had no other choice but to step in.

                      I just think that overall this is more of an issue with the tour refusing to deal with these idiots. We don't see this type of behavior at Augusta National during the Masters each spring.... why? Because they refuse to tolerate it. And it's worth noting that they sell beer to the patrons there too. Yet there's seldom an issue there.

                      And again, it's just a few bad characters who cause the majority of the problems, wherever it happens. As long as the tour continues to tolerate it - it will continue.

                      But calling out opposing team players for being too passionate about winning? That's just sour grapes.