Spuzz ...but only after being unnecessarily punished
I chose to think of it terminating a period where we were unnecessarily rewarded. I'll still be hitting it as long if not longer than when I took up the sport in my 20's. Of course I'm probably fitter and more athletic now at 63. Better looking too!
Sparky Bifurcation won't work. It doesn't work now. Nobody is stopping the recreation golfer right now from playing non-conforming balls and clubs. Nobody is stopping the recreational player from taking gimmes, taking mulligans, kicking the ball out of the rough, rolling it onto some nice grass, going back to the tee after a lost ball instead of dropping the ball and saying "this is close enough", taking the eraser to the scorecard.
You will still be able to do all of these things after a ball rollback
Of course bifurcation with the ball will work. It works now with what you described and is the essence of bifurcation (2 sets of rules). We already have bifurcation with no one playing exactly by USGA rules. Gimmes, mulligans, kicking the ball, preferred lies etc..
The USGA can't punish someone for taking a breakfast ball on the first tee. They can't hurt my game there. But by not allowing bifurcation with golf balls they are punishing peoples golf game for absolutely no reason.
I would hope the ball manufacturers would weigh in and tell the USGA that they will make two categories of golf balls. The restricted one for competitive golf and a non restrictive one for the non competitive recreational golfer.
I was hoping the PGA Tour was going to tell the USGA to go pound sand, but now I'm not so sure. But maybe the ball manufacturers will stand up to these elitists at the USGA. We'll see.
The manufactures as far as I know haven't commented yet.
Sneakylong The manufactures as far as I know haven't commented yet.
Taylormade CEO was on GC this morning. You may want to check it out. Almost all the biggies have made statements. Good respectful give and take this morning.
What’s the consensus from them? Anything about the USGA and R&A now announcing a “universal ball rollback?”
All I hear from the USGA and R&A is talking about the ball speeds from the Tour players. Nothing about the ball speeds from the other 99 percent of golfers.
Sneakylong
I’d rather hear a statement from The Golf Course Superintendents Association of America saying that amateur club level tee box lengths would be rolled back 5% as well (reinstitute those from 1990-ish). Where would complaints lie then?
Just saw a rerun on the Golf Channel from the USGA and the R&A. And the CEO from TaylorMade.
Two things I came away with. Just as I thought. Their minds were made up from the get go. They’re only worried about the elite player with high swing speeds.
They make most of their money from The Open and U.S. Open. Once again money talks. It’s all about the big hitters and elite players.
The CEO from TaylorMade is against this change, but will abide by it. They did say they’ll look at driver forgiveness next. Make it less forgiving. They said it will only affect the professionals and they’re not going to make the game harder for the average golfer.
I think I’ve heard that before. Don’t trust these guys at all. Bottom line is what I already knew. They’re hell bent on making the game harder for the elite player.
But as we know their decisions will filter down to the average hacker.
Edit: Seth Waugh CEO of the PGA of America said the changes will affect the recreational golfer. And they oppose any change that lessens the enjoyment of the game for recreational golfers.
Sneakylong They did say they’ll look at driver forgiveness next. Make it less forgiving. They said it will only affect the professionals and they’re not going to make the game harder for the average golfer.
No one is going to make 2 drivers, not financially practical. Besides, certain groups of golfers, and they are not 'elite' from seeing their scores, will still want the exact same clubs that the Pros play. Hell, these idiots are already out there with blades!! And 'just broke 90'!! 
Par4QC No one is going to make 2 drivers, not financially practical.
Exactly, it’s too expensive to retool and produce two drivers. So the less forgiving driver will be the only one offered.
They are totally out of touch. It’s the hardest sport to play and they’re so short sighted. Golfers are aspirational. They always trying to get better. The governing bodies mindset is trying make that harder to do.
Sneakylong I take my Launcher 400, or my 455DB, or Indio out ocassionally. I'm fairly good at hitting center so I don't see any loss of distance nor forgiveness over newer models.
These bigassed pancake driver heads have made everyone lazy golfers. Hit center and even an old 975 will go as far as the new.
Sneakylong They always trying to get better
But without actually “trying”.
I’ve been told, repeatedly, that pros hit it further because todays athletes are getting bigger/stronger, swing mechanics are better, clubs are fitted to them … yet the guys I play with are not more fit, they use the same old ugly swing, and grab stock clubs off the rack … yet they still gained distance. This is good news! If they want to get that 5% back they can actually try by tapping all that potential rather than just buying it. Sacrilege, I know.
Par4QC No one is going to make 2 drivers, not financially practical.
Sneakylong Exactly, it’s too expensive to retool and produce two drivers. So the less forgiving driver will be the only one offered.
Have you looked at the current offerings from the large manufacturers recently?
Callaway have 13 different driver options currently available (on their GB site), although this does include some of last year's models (the Rogue ST line). Titleist have 4 current models, Taylormade 7, and Ping have 9 (although that includes the 425 series as well as the 430).
There are several good arguments that can be made against having different equipment standards for high-level competition, but 'it's too expensive for the manufacturers to make several different types of club' is not one of them.
Par4QC I take my Launcher 400, or my 455DB, or Indio out ocassionally. I'm fairly good at hitting center so I don't see any loss of distance nor forgiveness over newer models.
I suspect that this won't be the case for most people - there have been significant advances in driver technology over the last 30 years in addition to the obvious change in size.
This YouTube video came up in my suggestions yesterday - not conclusive evidence (as it's a relatively small test, and doesn't show the full dataset), but I suspect that this will be closer to what most people would experience if comparing a modern driver against what was state of the art 20 or 25 years ago.
I’m for anything that helps make the game easier, thus more enjoyable for the masses.
MartinD but 'it's too expensive for the manufacturers to make several different types of club' is not one of them
Including such variants as the Cally triple diamond LS models. Same applies to balls - easy to tweak as they
already do it for the Pros. I don't have any concerns for the OEM Manufacturers - they'll survive.
However, it will be interesting to see how the OEM's 'advertise' the new products when the time comes.
Par4QC I take my Launcher 400, or my 455DB, or Indio out ocassionally. I'm fairly good at hitting center so I don't see any loss of distance nor forgiveness over newer models.
I’m sure we all have anecdotal stories. But there’s no question there’s measurable forgiveness gains that have been made. Maybe it’s not perceivable to some, but engineering wise it’s there.
Again, I’ll take all the latest technology that helps make the game easier. I’m never going to be in favor of going backwards.
Ok, now they aren't talking about '5%' loss. They are saying the PGA Pros will lose 9-11 yds., LPGA 5-7, and amateurs only 5.
We wasted 527 posts on something trivial. We could have discussed boobies.
They seem to keep getting bigger, albeit artificially most times.
MartinD There are several good arguments that can be made against having different equipment standards for high-level competition, but 'it's too expensive for the manufacturers to make several different types of club' is not one of them
Not my opinion, but from someone I heard on PGA Radio. They said retooling head size, forgiveness etc., with driver heads will cost money.
Just as retooling the golf ball will. How much is relative I suppose. But that’s the reason given as to why bifurcation isn’t happening.
Sneakylong
Easier isn’t inherently better, nor more enjoyable. I would much rather play a game of chess than tic-tac-toe. And, yes, I realize that golf is tough (not tic-tac-toe simple), but the distances added to the game over the last thirty plus years have not made me enjoy the game any more. The addictive part for me was in the challenge. Making the challenge harder simply makes the reward greater.
