Par4QC Negative, ghost rider. If you're playing by the rules and holing out, then you hit 18 shots per round. No more, no less.

      puttnfool I'll admit my lack of knowledge here in the adjustable driver realm. When you adjust the loft/face angle, does the logo on the shaft change orientation?

      I don't participate much anymore, but I can't help myself. You don't know the answer to that question but you feel you know enough to declare spine aligning as snake oil?

          Par4QC My point about the ZZ lites....they are stiff tipped, high bend shafts. Ever play other shafts with that profile and do well with them?

          Ahhh, I see. No - never. That bend profile would not work for me another head. Do you think PING aligned those in mass production?

              sdandrea1 That bend profile would not work for me another head

              Now Steve, that statement just makes no sense. I'm giving you a reason to HO. You need a set of heads with similar lofts as the Eye 2 heads, and another set of ZZ lite shafts, no?😜

                  Par4QC You need a set of heads with similar lofts as the Eye 2 heads, and another set of ZZ lite shafts, no

                  That sounds like another set of Eye 2 irons. 😙

                      puttnfool If you're playing by the rules and holing out, then you hit 18 shots per round. No more, no less.

                      puttnfool Bottom line is, we all miss all but 18 times each round.

                      You cannot even comprehend your own statements!! You can damn well miss every shot, every round. As well as I can go for every damn 551 yd. hole, every time, every round!

                      You now know nothing about clubmaking, as well as nothing about the game of chess.(btw, you cannot move into checkmate, so you will need to delete your answer in that other thread, or retire the king)

                            kchacker well, when the guy that wrote a 5 (was it 5?) page article about it says he doesn't align his, I think I'm close to the truth. If you read that article, it's obvious that no one really knows what's going on. All they do is theorize and hope they're right.

                            The take a club they can't hit, spin it around until it vibrates like they like, then put it together. They go back out with it and hit it better because they think it's better and they believe they're on to something.

                            Simple fact is, I bet any of the top 10 golfers in the world could take my clubs and shoot even par with them. They're probably a solid 2 flexes too soft for them, none are "aligned", and the grip size is probably bigger than they like. Quite simply, the most important part of where the ball goes when you hit it is NOT whether the shaft is "aligned". The most important variable is the swing. As has been said before, practice more and you will score much lower than if you spend that time spinning your shafts around to some arbitrarily determined point.

                                Where the hell is John Fisher to straighten this guy out properly???

                                puttnfool Simple fact is, I bet any of the top 10 golfers in the world could take my clubs and shoot even par with them. They're probably a solid 2 flexes too soft for them, none are "aligned", and the grip size is probably bigger than they like. Quite simply, the most important part of where the ball goes when you hit it is NOT whether the shaft is "aligned". The most important variable is the swing. As has been said before, practice more and you will score much lower than if you spend that time spinning your shafts around to some arbitrarily determined point.

                                This makes a lot of sense to me, however, I have made the same argument about club fitting religion. Given enough talent and practice we could all probably shoot our best with misaligned and poorly fit clubs on a good day. That being said, there is no good reason NOT to get fit (if you have the $) or NOT scientifically build our clubs to the most consistent tolerances we can, given that building skill and the right building equipment. I just think the golf talent is more critical than the fitting/aligning.

                                    puttnfool well, when the guy that wrote a 5 (was it 5?) page article about it says he doesn't align his,

                                    The was Tutelman, and you got caught on this in another thread about this. He doesn't align his shafts because he has enough expertise to order shafts he knows don't need it. Very few others have that knowledge including you Mr. Wizard.

                                        sdandrea1 probably so. I don't build clubs because I think I'm gonna build the perfect club. I build so I can tinker with stuff and play anything I want.

                                        Just so happens, I've been fortunate enough to build clubs for others, both in person and over the internet, that helped their games as well.

                                            Rickochet No, it was Dave Tutleman, not John Kaufman. I always order shafts that don't need aligned... because no shafts "need" aligned. Anyone can have any knowledge they want.

                                            BTW, genius, Mr. Wizard died June 12, 2007.

                                                sdandrea1 Rick - is this because the driver shaft has the most "flex-movement" in the swing? Do stiffer shafts have less risk for this topic? Do steel shafts have spines? I am curious.

                                                Steve, the biggest difference is steel vs. graphite. Steel iron alignment is a totally different animal.

                                                  Par4QC You're fun. You argue just like a democrat resorting to name calling when you've run out of coherent arguments to try to prove your flawed point.

                                                  You're fun.

                                                      puttnfool MY flawed point?

                                                      gudgawd man....get back to class. Who is even reading this for you?

                                                        puttnfool I don't build clubs because I think I'm gonna build the perfect club. I build so I can tinker with stuff and play anything I want.

                                                        Me, as well.

                                                        puttnfool Just so happens, I've been fortunate enough to build clubs for others, both in person and over the internet, that helped their games as well.

                                                        Me, as well, but they could have been built better. I have only recently begun pre-cutting my iron shafts at both ends and using split grips and tip weights to dry fit and get all the swingweights spot on with 1/2" increments. I weigh each shaft, head and grip to match up the weights as a 8 individual matchups and tip-weight if needed. I have noticed some pretty inconsistent gaps in weights from iron clubhead to clubhead. Shafts and grips seem much more consistent in weight.

                                                        I would probably align the shafts if I knew how and had the stuff, but mostly from a building pride standpoint to have them locked in consistent. Still not convinced I'd notice a diff in play.