Rickochet

I'd like one stroke as well. However, I'm guessing they can't treat it like a red stake hazard because in that case you would have the option on hitting out of Mrs. Brown's flower bed (destroying private property) or near a busy street (possibly getting hit by a car). They could just say you have to take a drop with no option of hitting it from outside the out of bounds stake.

As I remember there were 3 options. I liked the drop in the fairway because of the time factor and you could very well drill your provisional out of bounds as well.

    Sneakylong I'd like one stroke as well. However, I'm guessing they can't treat it like a red stake hazard because in that case you would have the option on hitting out of Mrs. Brown's flower bed (destroying private property) or near a busy street (possibly getting hit by a car).

    Simple fix. Add a new stake color. Blue, black, whatever. Play it like a red stake hazard but you have no option of hitting it.

      Rickochet ok, but OB was never meant to be penalized like a lateral hazard. It is stroke and distance for a reason. A one-stroke penalty is attractive, sure, but it doesn't serve the purpose that OB was defined for.

      IMO, it has to stay two strokes.

        rsvman

        I agree. My home course like many Florida courses has a lot of out of bounds because of homes on the golf course. The 2 stroke penalty isn't the issue as much with me. The option to take a drop 2 club lengths once you reach the fairway no closer to the hole is a nice option that saves time. IMO.

        It saves time because you don't need to hit a provisional and are guaranteed to be lying 3 in the fairway. It's still a stroke and distance penalty, but takes away the possibility of hitting another bad tee shot and getting a huge number.

        We play a Quota game and pick up after a double anyway, but this new rule is a good option. Again, without looking it up there were 3 options. This was the best option IMO.

        Also, this rule change is not a blanket new USGA rule. It's an option that your course can adopt as a local rule. I think any course with a lot of out of bounds it's worth considering.

        I was reading golf course reviews about courses in reasonable distance from my home and most of the low ratings where about slow play, five hour rounds and inactive rangers. Any rule that slows play is detrimental to the success of golf courses, many that are already struggling to make it.

        Under equitable scoring control rules for keeping handicaps, the big number usually won't count, anyway. Pick up and move on.

          MidwayJ

          I'm sure that's what most people do. But you can't do that in a tournament. Played with a guy who had a 12 on a hole in our Senior Club Championship. Had to count every shot. Realize most probably don't play in tournaments anyway.

          Like I said we pick up after a double, but there are times when you're not sure your shot went out of bounds. So you hit a provisional. We have several holes with out of bounds that still could be reached in 2 shots after taking a drop in the fairway.

          So a 5 on a par 4 or a 6 on a par 5 is possible. Anyway, not looking for an argument. I like the new option myself. Like I said my course has lots of out of bounds and water, so losing golf balls is an issue. Anytime I can save on possibly losing a golf ball I'm all in favor of that.

            You'd better not try that if playing with me. Your score for HC purposes has nothing to do with your score in my match. You play by the ROG or forfeit.

              Sneakylong

              I was reacting to this post:

              "perfectly fine as long as the score is not entered for handicap purposes. I have many friends who don't keep one and will play by whatever rules they make up."

              My only point is once you have exceeded your ESC score for that hole it would not change how the score was entered for handicap purposes.

                atticusfinch You'd better not try that if playing with me. Your score for HC purposes has nothing to do with your score in my match. You play by the ROG or forfeit.

                And you'd better not allow taking 10 shots to get out of a creek bed if you are the group in front of me. By the way, my post was not in reference to match play.

                • ode likes this.

                MidwayJ

                And my point is having the option of taking a drop instead of hitting a provisional is a good thing. I guess I just don't understand the pushback against having this option.

                Maybe if you play a course with parallel fairways and no out of bounds it isn't an issue. But my course has no parallel fairways and 15 holes have out of bounds.

                The equitable score thing isn't really an issue here. I'm above a 9 handicap now so I can take up to a 7 on a hole. And even though we pick up after a double bogey in our Quota game I'd still like the option of not hitting a provisional and taking a drop to have the chance at a bogey.

                IMO anytime the USGA gives you more options that's generally a good thing.

                  Sneakylong
                  I was not pushing back on the suggestion. I agree with it as long as it's an additional option and not in place of stroke and distance.

                    MidwayJ

                    According to the video it is an additional option. So you still can hit a provisional. Once you hit a provisional though then this option is no longer an option. Although in most cases I'd think this would be the safer option. It also includes a lost ball as long as it's not in a penalty (hazard) area.

                    Here's a link to the USGA video explaining the new rule that a course can adopt as a local rule.

                    http://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules-hub/rules-modernization/major-changes/golfs-new-rules-stroke-and-distance.html

                    The slowing-down-play excuse is a cop-out and always has been. It takes a maximum of 30 seconds to hit a provisional ball. I realize that we've all hit a shot that we expected to find and didn't. But if there is even a chance that my ball could be lost or OB, I hit a provisional. Its not that big a deal, and in fact the sole purpose of hitting a provisional is to save time.

                    What takes forever is someone hitting a ball in the woods or likely out-of-bounds, refusing to hit a provisional ball because they swear they know exactly where it is and/or it will miraculously ricochet back onto the course, then spending 5 minutes looking for a ball 50 yards ahead of where it is likely to be and finally declaring that it is much too late to go back to the tee now so they might as well drop one here. And sadly, this is what has become the new normal.

                    That being said, I've always felt that stroke-and-distance for OB is too severe a penalty. I have played many golf courses where a ball could land on the fairway or even on the green but end up OB. I believe a penalty stroke and drop under the water hazard rule for environmentally-sensitive areas would be more appropriate (i.e., playing from OB is prohibited - you must take a penalty stroke and drop a ball under the water hazard rule). But I actually have no problem with stroke-and-distance for a lost ball - how can you drop a ball within 2 club lengths of an unknown location? So there will still be a reason for hitting a provisional ball.

                      eltigrecda

                      You're not limited to 2 club lengths for a lost ball from where it was lost. You have an imaginary line from the hole to where you believe it is lost. Then you have an imaginary line from the hole to the edge of the fairway. You can take a drop anywhere in between those two lines and 2 club lengths on either side (or outside) of those two lines.

                      Nobody is forced to use this new rule. We'll be adopting it in our Quota game.

                      I'm all for speeding up play. I think a 2-stroke penalty and a proper drop at the last known position of the ball before it enters OB is more than sufficient to account for everything. It's not like the probability of a probable double-bogey or worse is gonna change the status of a match in that situation.

                      If everyone in the group is playing by the same standard of rules, that's all that matters imo.

                      Question: When in a cart equipped with GPS, many of them have an elapsed time clock on board and calculates if you are on pace or ahead/behind the suggested time. Does this influence your speed of play?

                      I check it from time to time but I'd answer my own question with I pay more attention to the group in front or back of me.

                      Not sure why, but it most always seems that I'm the only guy in the group looking ahead to where the group in front of me is, and looking over my shoulder to see if people behind me are waiting on me/my group.

                      Unfortunately there just seems to be a huge disconnect. Most players don't give 2 shits about where they are in relation to the group ahead, or the group following them.

                      On more than one occasion, as a foursome, there have been groups who push us. I'm always eager to let them play through, provided that there's not a backlog of groups ahead.

                      Just seems that courtesy and decorum nowadays have been replaced with a sense of entitlement.