Great Article for the Loft Jacking people

Typhoon

An excerpt from /about Ping

Everything about the PING i530 irons screams ball speed. The forged maraging steel face is the same technology PING uses in its metalwoods. The CG is 10 percent lower, the machined rear wall is 40 percent thinner and the lofts are 1.5 to two degrees stronger across the board than the i525.

Yep, stronger-lofted. But don’t light those loft-jacking torches without a quick history lesson.

Karsten and, before him, Toney Penna with MacGregor, found that lowering the CG and adding perimeter weighting made a golf club more forgiving. The problem was that combination would launch the ball to too high, spin it too much and balloon it all over the place. The solution was to strengthen lofts, loft-jacking if you will. But understand loft-jacking without low CG and perimeter weighting creates a club that’s borderline unplayable.

KCee

Typhoon I am not opposed to strengthening lofts with a club that has a low enough CoG to hit it higher, but I still might order these with their "Retro Spec" lofts. I tend to punch a lot of my iron shots and de-loft any way so I don't really want a 6i much less than 30* like my P770 is.

I don't "flip" any more and have learned to hit the ball lower. I no longer need a 4i to get under a tree; I can hood a 6i or even 7i and keep it down. Heck if you forced me I can flight my 52* under most trees. I don't have the SS to balloon an iron unless there's a lot of wind into me. I need an 8i for 150 most of the time. Not a big deal as most of my buddies need 6 or 7 or even a hybrid.

SMT

Typhoon Toney Penna with MacGregor, found that lowering the CG and adding perimeter weighting made a golf club more forgiving.

And Mr. Penna, armed with that knowledge, chose to send out multiple sets or designs without it?

Typhoon But understand loft-jacking without low CG and perimeter weighting creates a club that’s borderline unplayable.

So, Tony is leading us to believe that a player or a skilled player couldn't play, say, a 7 iron that has been "jacked to a 6 or a 5? That is ridiculous. Sure, at some point UP the line, 3, 2 1nd 1 irons would be brutal, but not the rest of the set.

pellmell

Typhoon The CG is 10 percent lower

The Ping i530 has an actual VCOG of .845", which is not low by any standard. For comparison, the VCOG of the Ping s58, a "better player" iron, is .675".

Luc_Van_Daele

Typhoon But understand loft-jacking without low CG and perimeter weighting creates a club that’s borderline unplayable.

In the old days an 19° 2 iron was borderline 'unplayable' and amateur sets started with a 22° 3 iron, now because of loft jacking 1-3 irons no longer exist and the 19° 4 iron is the borderline 'unplayable' club in the set; amateur sets starting with a 22° 5 iron.

azgreg

Can't wait until my set of clubs will have 7 wedges in it.

Stu1961

azgreg
Lol, I think at that point, technically, my set of wedges would have 3 irons in it.

toraider

KCee I still might order these with their "Retro Spec" lofts.

I did this when I ordered my irons, I needed the extra loft with my Negative AoA swing flaw.

Par4QC

I find it odd that the USGA determines how a driver is fabricated, but not irons.
Players were hitting drivers 300 yds. 30+ years ago. No one was coming close to hitting a 6i 220. (I've seen those people, btw😉)
Dogs barking.
Wrong tree!!

Sneakylong

My TaylorMade Sim Max OS irons have jacked up lofts, but they go plenty high. I can deloft them thru impact and hit them a long way, but they’re not functional golf shots. Slower swing speeds need trajectory to hold greens. Again, the modern jacked up lofted irons go plenty high.

A side note. My golf buddy knew Toney Penna. He was with Nabisco when they were sponsoring tournaments. He went to see Penna at his Florida home and Toney and another guy were hitting brand new golf balls into the ocean. lol He speaks very highly of Toney Penna.

sdandrea1

Sneakylong deloft them thru impact and hit them a long way, but they’re not functional golf shots.

Exactly. Why do we need our irons to go farther? They're scoring clubs, not play/position clubs.

ode

pellmell .845

That's high......maybe it's lower than it's prior gen model🤔. I dunno what the i530 is up against in the Ping line, but presumably 500 series not the 200 but ???

Typhoon

Luc_Van_Daele And they sell you the 4 hybrid that costs more than a 4 iron.

Gotta remember too in the “old days” the balls that were designed for those clubs were clubs from that era so stuff worked.

Typhoon

It’s amazing that people read that Golf Magazine excerpt and the only takeaway is distance… accuracy is what I see. Shorter length club.

Being someone who hit blades and the i500 irons this year, I can tell you first hand 150 yards is 150 yards. Hitting PW into a green is far more automatic than hitting an 8 iron. Doesn’t matter what the loft is.

ode

Typhoon I have not read the article. ....I will get to it. IMO jacked lofts really isn't a thing anymore unless one is purist blade user. 32* is the 7i, although 30-32* is pretty common, once it's lower than that it's something else IMO. What gets lost is the fit/lie angle/length and shaft used. Club length is longer, shaft is lighter and in some cases the head is lighter and essentially made to prior spec with a different # on it. PXG XP is one example I can confirm to be the case. ill fit clubs with stronger lofts leads to poor play and the occasional flushed shot that goes far. I don't take any issue with stronger lofts but there still is a cut off for people as to what's useful in an iron. I do not go lower than 30* in a conventional iron, 32* is good then it's hybrids or a utility iron next. I don't believe ANY of the marketing the OEMs pump out.

Sparky

Typhoon Hitting PW into a green is far more automatic than hitting an 8 iron. Doesn’t matter what the loft is.

Exactly why I printed out 13 "PW" labels and put them over all my club numbers. Much easier to hit a PW.

sdandrea1

ode Club length is longer, shaft is lighter and in some cases the head is lighter and essentially made to prior spec with a different # on it.

So essentially, your new 7 iron now has an 8 on the sole. 👍

My PXG0211 8 iron is the same length, loft and swing weight as several of my old school 7 irons. I bought 8-GW so I could play what I consider to be 7-PW. I STILL have to add a 52 and 56 wedge to the set.

sdandrea1

Sparky Exactly why I printed out 13 "PW" labels and put them over all my club numbers. Much easier to hit a PW.

Giphy - Cracking Up Lol GIF

Sparky, you're the best🤣

Luc_Van_Daele

I've played both of these side by side (reshafted with the exaclty same shafts, grips, lenghts and swingweights):

PING I3 blade 7 Iron : lenght 36.75" loft 34.5° lie 63° (black dot) sw D1
PING I-blade 7 Iron : lenght 37" loft 34° lie 62° (+1° blue dot) sw D2

Marketing said every new club was longer, straighter and more forgiving then the one from the previous year. With the I-blade the claim was only straighter and more forgiving but not longer since the set was made (on popular demand) with old school lofts. I did not find any difference in playing lenght, ball flight or dispertion with center and off-center hits. Only had a small preference in feel for the old I3's, so I sold the newer I-blades. Compairing clubheads with the same specs but 17 years of technology apart did not convince me of a lot of progress.

sdandrea1

Luc_Van_Daele Compairing clubheads with the same specs but 17 years of technology apart did not convince me of a lot of progress.

Hence the IsI irons in my current bag. The ZING2 will probably get more play while I reshaft the ISI to graphite. I contend that if your goal with an iron is to hit it a certain distance (NOT as far as possible), then why is an iron that goes farther a better club? Irons are irons, wedges are wedges. I'll die on this hill.🤣

Stu1961

sdandrea1
Because the iron that goes further now allows me to hit to the distances that age and injury, despite my best efforts with over-swinging, no longer allowed me to reach. If someone offers me the Fountain of Youth … I’m drinking! At some point I’ll no longer be able to dip into that well - but until then, why not delude myself into thinking I haven’t lost anything by using all the tech available?