@"PA-PLAYA"#p263440But I certainly overestimated the decent loyalty of quite a few.

Why do you think they should feel any sense of loyalty? The PGA is practically a monopoly. If a player is good enough to play on the world stage, and wants to earn big bucks doing so (prior to LIV) they had to sign whatever agreement the PGA put before them. More than a few who have jumped ship have expressed their belief that their deal with the PGA was less than "fair". Would you feel indebted, or loyalty, to an organization which you believe treated you unfairly?

I don't understand the loyalty expectations completely. These players earned their way thru the amateur events, mini-tours and eventually the big show by individual performance. It's not like the PGA Tour hired them based on a resume, trained and developed them, promoted them, etc. The player's earnings came from sponsors and TV $. What has the PGA invested in them that creates an expectation of loyalty?

    sdandrea1 I agree. The players have to achieve a certain amount to even be able to essentially sign a non-compete agreement.

    Not quite apples to apples, but the PGA Tour lured away many of the rest of the world's greatest players by paying more money for tournament wins and now LIV is luring players away by.......paying more money period. IMO the Tour should do nothing, but make sure that they offer the best place to work so that they get the best talent.....like actual companies have to do.

        Eguller The PGA provides the venue, stage, $$$ and the opportunity to play for those $$$ if you qualify.

        That's not an investment in the players. It's the method they use to support their charities and their extravagant salaries/benefits.

          KCee IMO the Tour should do nothing, but make sure that they offer the best place to work so that they get the best talent.....like actual companies have to do.

          Yep. They're over-reacting. They appear desperate.

            Eguller The PGA provides the venue, stage, $$$ and the opportunity to play for those $$$ if you qualify.

            And now someone else is providing another avenue to all that. The PGA was the only place to go for those players for a long time. Much like the NBA and then along came the ABA which gave players another avenue to showcase their skills. Or the NFL and the AFL. Competition is a good thing for the worker.

                Sneakylong that the PGA Tour does not even control the major tournaments in golf (such as the Masters)

                I suppose I'd need to check the qualifications for entering each of those Majors, but I believe all would hinge on a 'membership', as the base. For next year's events( Majors), it looks like the entry requirements might be set, due to 'finishing placements' from this year's events, except PGA Championship. But after that, no, the LIV players will essentially be barred from entry, unless they do get an invitation(Masters). I'm doubting those folks will invite from LIV Tour, in 2024. They would have to 'recognize' that tour's backers in the process.

                The whole shitball about LIV....is political. Like we didn't know that already.

                  PA-PLAYA overestimated the decent loyalty of quite a few.

                  Loyalty to family always comes 1st, not to any organization, 'job', etc..
                  I've always respected your thoughts in your posts pertaining to such.

                    garyt1957 And now someone else is providing another avenue to all that. The PGA was the only place to go for those players for a long time.

                    There are numerous professional tours all over the world for those skilled enough..... ask Koepka as an example.

                        https://www.golfchannel.com/news/padraig-harrington-has-no-empathy-henrik-stenson-new-euro-captain-pretty-soon

                        Paddy's take on Hendrik Stenson reneging on his contractual obligations to the Ryder Cup.

                        https://www.msn.com/en-gb/sport/golf/stewart-cink-suggests-europe-s-passion-for-ryder-cup-a-sham-after-liv-defections/ar-AAZPyOV

                        Then we have Stewart Cink calling out European Ryder Cup players passion as a sham after defecting to LIV.

                          Sneakylong Stewart Cink calling out European Ryder Cup players passion as a sham

                          The whole thing is a sham. What was meant to be a friendly competition between two countries somehow blossomed into a sponsor's wet dream of a must see rivalry. He's calling out Stenson?

                          Cink's record 5-7-7
                          Stenson's record 10-7-2

                            Eguller There are numerous professional tours all over the world for those skilled enough..... ask Koepka as an example.

                            Not at the highest level. If you wanted really big money it was the PGA Tour and maybe the DP to a lesser extent. Obviously DJ isn't going to go to the Asian or Australian Tour to make a 10th of what he's making now. We're talking about the superstars now.

                              “I do think it's different in Henrik's case, yes. He signed a contract not to do that and was specifically asked not to do that.”

                              That's an interesting quote of Harrington in the article. Did Stenson actually sign a contract saying he wouldn't join LIV?

                                Eguller As I said earlier, Stenson knew and chose his own fate as to the Ryder Cup, etc. - now live with it.and
                                stop whining.

                                Is Stenson whining? I haven't heard anything about that. If he is, then yea too bad everybody here knew he would lose the captaincy if he went LIV. Hard to believe he thought otherwise. But like I said, I haven't heard any of that

                                    johnnydoom That's an interesting quote of Harrington in the article. Did Stenson actually sign a contract saying he wouldn't join LIV?

                                    Posted this earlier. Stenson violated his contract. Pure and simple.

                                    “There's been a lot of speculation back and forth, but I am fully committed to the captaincy and to Ryder Cup Europe and the job at hand,” Stenson said then. “The captain does sign a contract. He's the only one that does that. Players and vice captains don't. But the captain has an agreement, and those agreements are between Ryder Cup Europe and the captain, so I'm fully committed to my role as a captain and working hard toward the result we want in Rome.”

                                    “The successful candidate will be expected during his tenure to commit to supporting the Ryder Cup and the DP World Tour exclusively, and therefore, by extension, not supporting or promoting other properties [including, without limitation, other Tours, Leagues, Series or Competitions].”