NFL THREAD

sdandrea1 · 2021-09-27T12:40:17+00:00

Last night's Packers v 49ers OMG.

propman

johnnydoom Bryce has a very small frame for a football player, that's for sure.
Can't imagine him surviving too many serious hits which I'm assuming are gonna arrive given the team he is on.

johnnydoom

propman He is tough and took quite a few big hits in college. Not the size and speed coming at him as a pro, but he is a tough dude. I don't think he overcomes the vision thing, but for his sake I hope I'm wrong. I agree with Spuzz that even though he accomplished great things in college, there isn't any way I would think he's the number one overall pick. I do like and respect the guy though. In his passing accuracy and his ability to deliver in the face of the rush he actually reminds me a lot of Aaron Rodgers.

Spuzz

propman During last night's game, they showed the 1st years of present day stud QBs.
They all had dismal stats.

Stats are for losers.
CJ Stroud looks like he has "it"
The rest of the these newbies do not.
(Fields, Kyler Murray, Zach Wilson, Young, Mac Jones, Daniel Jones)
Maybe Bagent has some of "it", but we'll never know as long as he's a Bear.
Maybe Will Levis and Joshua Dobbs and Richardson as well. Jury still out on them
JMO.

propman

Spuzz point is nobody can predict what a rookie QB will do based on 1 yr in NFL. Makes for good discussion, tho.
JMO

johnnydoom

Spuzz I'm a homer for Mac Jones. I do believe he has what it takes but it sure isn't gelling for him if he does. C.J. Stroud looks like gold right now. He can pass the ball as good as any Pro I've ever seen. I don't know how good his heart or toughness will be due to limited exposure to his play.

Spuzz

propman point is nobody can predict what a rookie QB will do based on 1 yr in NFL. Makes for good discussion, tho.

Agree.
I will add that you can get a pretty good idea what they won't be.
😉

sdandrea1

sdandrea1 Go BEARS!!!!!

Told ya.........,😎

sdandrea1

I turned that game on last night and thought I was seeing the Broncos. Orange on orange!

mulegolf

I kinda like the orange unis. I know a lot of people don't though.

MartinD

I've seen a few people use a categorisation of quarterbacks that I think is useful - 'win with' or 'win because of'. In other words, is a quarterback the reason for a team's success? Can he carry the offence without needing star-quality players around him?

Most QBs in the NFL are 'win with' guys - some of them are in very successful offences (Kirk Cousins, for example, seems to me a good example of a high-end 'win-with' QB). The problem comes when you have a 'win with' quarterback, but don't have the talent around him for the offence to succeed - Mac Jones and Bryce Young are in that position at the moment. C.J. Stroud seems to me to be on the borderline between the two categories - the Texans' offence has been very productive despite not appearing to have star-level talent and with a patchwork offensive line, but it's hard to draw a definitive conclusion from half a season's worth of games.

Spuzz

MartinD win with' quarterback, - Mac Jones

don't win with, like I said (see today's Germany game) LOL
😉

Par4QC

MartinD

professor

johnnydoom
Well, it sure as hell has worked for Patrick Mahomes!

johnnydoom

professor At 20 yards and about 4 attempts per game, I don't consider Patrick Mahomes to be a running QB. He is a good runner when he does, but they don't call a lot of planned runs for him or rely heavily on his ability to run. Jalen, by comparison averages over 50 yards and about 11 rushing attempts per game. He's a big, strong guy and maybe he'll carry them in that fashion for a good long time. Hopefully he doesn't get all busted up like the other big strong guy, Cam Newton, who averaged about 8 attempts and 38 yards per game.

Just like unstoppable tight ends, the NFL solution to beating rushing quarterbacks is literally "beating" them. They eventually stop trying to defend the play and just try to pound the player as hard as they can when ever they get the chance until they break them down. Jalen is very good at collision avoidance though, so he may have a better chance at long term success.

professor

johnnydoom Jalen, by comparison averages over 50 yards and about 11 rushing attempts per game.

That's not accurate for this year. They've stopped running RPO's. He's averaged 9 rushes per game this season. And, 17 of his total 88 rushes have been with the QB sneak (aka tush-push).

professor

johnnydoom At 20 yards and about 4 attempts per game, I don't consider Patrick Mahomes to be a running QB.

Waiting on a much anticipated in-season match-up between the Eagles and Chiefs. Going over some of the 'stats' from the most recent Super Bowl, I noticed that Patrick Mahomes had 6 carries for 44 yards. I'd consider him a threat.

Sneakylong

I see where they’re not going to allow Michigan head coach Jim Harbaugh to be on the sidelines for the remainder of the season.

For stealing signals is what I understand. Supposedly he knew someone affiliated with Michigan that was going to upcoming opponents games and stealing signals.

I agree with Michigan alum Charles Woodson that this is all a bunch of bullshit. Harbaugh hasn’t even been given a chance to defend himself.

Everyone has an iPhone and can video anything these days. If you don’t want someone stealing signals etc. then cover your mouth like the NFL coaches do.

Richard Sherman says are they going outlaw watching film next. Gawd forbid if they’re able to pick up something watching film. Harbaugh should join his brother in the NFL again.

rsvman2

Sneakylong This is maybe a tenth of the story. Said 'guy' travelled to games at opposing teams' stadiums, at least once disguised himself and stood on the opposing team's sideline to learn all their signs. Michigan knew pretty much every offensive play before it was run.

It is a coincidence that Harbaugh's teams were mediocre and he was on the hot seat and then, starting at the time the sign stealing began, they suddenly became a powerhouse and in the top ten all the time? Perhaps. But it does make one wonder.

garyt1957

Sneakylong. Michigan hired an ex military guy trained in that sort of thing. He went to other teams games and studied their signs. That's illegal. Should it be? Don't know and don't care. Michigan knew it was illegal and did it anyway, then lied about it.
Stealing signs at the game your playing is legal.and everybody does it or tries to. What Michigan did was a cut above.
The sign stealing also coincides with Michigan's return to dominance in the Big 10.
Harbaugh can coach the team all week he just can't be at the games. Seems like a slap on the wrist to me. The OC and DC are calling the plays during the game anyway.
Why the NCAA doesn't just go to audio in the helmets is beyond me.

mulegolf

Sneakylong I see where they’re not going to allow Michigan head coach Jim Harbaugh to be on the sidelines for the remainder of the season.

They are almost punishing him. My God, that's nothing. He can't be on the sidelines for 3 games. He still can be at all practices, do the game planning, etc.

Sneakylong

johnnydoom

professor That's not accurate for this year.

Good to see they are working to reduce his running load.

Sneakylong

rsvman2 This is maybe a tenth of the story. Said 'guy' travelled to games at opposing teams' stadiums, at least once disguised himself and stood on the opposing team's sideline to learn all their signs. Michigan knew pretty much every offensive play before it was run

Let’s say this is all true. So what? I could sit on the opposing side with my iPhone and video tape whatever. If I’m able to decipher your signs then change things up.

If you allow someone on your sideline who doesn’t belong there then it’s on you. You’re an idiot.

It’s all bullshit. If I’m studying film and I pick up what they’re going to do from watching the film then I’m not suppose to not use that to my advantage. 😏

Then make watching film against the rules.

I was a blackjack player back in the day. Casino’s didn’t want card counters playing in their Casinos. If they suspected you of card counting they’d throw you out.

Which was bullshit as well. It someone is smart enough to count cards to give them an advantage that’s somehow cheating. 🙄

Same in poker. If someone is a dumbass and shows his hand you’re not supposed to look. Or if they give a tell. Just ignore it.

Why do NFL coaches hold the play sheet up to their mouths when calling a play? They know people can lip read. If someone is able to lib read is that cheating? 🤔

I say it’s all bullshit. Hire someone who can make it harder to figure out what your signals are. This isn’t like performance enhancing drugs. This is operating within the system to your advantage.

Tom Brady didn’t have the best arm or the best athletic ability. What he did do was work harder. Including film study.

If thru studying film he knew what defenses were going to do. Is that cheating? Still with Charles Woodson. It’s all bullshit.😉

Most of this stuff is gamesmanship.

propman

Wasn't Harbaugh suspended earlier in the year for a recruitment infraction?

professor

Sneakylong Most of this stuff is gamesmanship.

Isn't "gamesmanship" cheating when you get caught?
Was it gamesmanship when Belichick was caught in "spygate"? He was fined $500,000?

rsvman2

Sneaky has normalized cheating by being a Patriots fan for so long. I get it. But there is a specific rule and the good folks at Michigan broke it. Where I come from, that's called cheating.

Sneakylong

rsvman2 Sneaky has normalized cheating by being a Patriots fan for so long. I get it. But there is a specific rule and the good folks at Michigan broke it. Where I come from, that's called cheating.

Spygate was a joke as well. You could film opponents except at a direct angle. Lol Jimmy Johnson said they all did it.

Former Patriots coach Eric Mangini when he was head coach of the Jets told Belichick not to film the Jets. Belichick did anyway and Mangini turned him in. Lol. The Patriots kicked the Jets ass anyway.

Deflategate was another joke. Brady played better in the second half of the Colts game. Brady kept winning long after that.

If you don’t want teams to try to get an advantage then ban film study. All this stuff isn’t as egregious as it’s made out to be. I’m surprised no one ever learned what Peyton Mannings ‘Omaha’ meant. Or maybe they did.🤔

“Manning stated that “Omaha was just an indicator word.” “It served as a signal that the play had been altered, the clock was running out of time, and the ball needed to be snapped immediately to sort of signal to my offensive lineman that we had switched to Plan B and that the clock was running out.” If they did, Manning won anyway.

Jim Harbaugh should go back to the NFL. Just as Pete Carroll did after violating NCAA rules at USC.

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