USGA & R&A distance rollback.

raggmann54

I'm sure Bernie Baymiller would have had some choice words for these "rules guys"...

Subsonic

Bifurcation is the solution.

If they roll back the ball papaD will be unable to get off the tee.

Typhoon

Who cares... fuck 'em... just go out and have fun, play what you want. None of us are going on tour and if the quality of what is on TV goes south, again, who cares, watch something else.

Stu1961

They already have bifurcation ... those who play by the rules, and those who do not. If the non-pro wants to play a hot ball or driver - they are out there already. IMO, A real bifurcation would result in the game splitting more like softball versus baseball. The only people people who would use the non-USGA rules would be those who could no longer keep up (those getting older who still wanted to play the blue tees but should be playing the silvers). I know I'm in two leagues currently that would stick with whatever the USGA ruled.

Subsonic

Most people cannot drive the ball far enough as it is. Why make it harder?

Why doesn't the PGA just develop a rota of courses for tournaments? Make the TPC courses for Tourney play? It is just not the equipment now. The players are athletes too. That was not the case twenty to thirty years ago.

Typhoon

Subsonic I agree with the guys being athletes. Between that and tech improvements ...

Eguller

Subsonic It is just not the equipment now. The players are athletes too. That was not the case twenty to thirty years ago.

Lee Trevino was asked what was the innovation that led to distance issue and he said " John Deere ".
He has a point. Watch any of the old Shell TV shows and it is obvious.

Honestly, it is a combination of the ball (post 1990), equipment, agronomy, athleticism, bigger & stronger, etc.
Can't roll back most of that.

Weirfan

Subsonic

most definitely it is nutrition and fitness advances as well as better swing and analysis equipment to maximize launch parameters etc.

They have already lengthened and toughened courses. Augusta National has been buying up surrounding property for years, extending tees and guys like Bryson were still hitting wedges into par 5's. They could make all fairways 20 yards wide and have 8 inch US open rough each week, that would probably help, but doubt many would enjoy that product on tv week in week out.

so why equipment? IMO it is the easiest thing for them to control

mikeintopeka

Subsonic Why doesn't the PGA just develop a rota of courses for tournaments? Make the TPC courses for Tourney play?

There are probably some good reasons why some of the TPC venues have never seen the light of day in hosting a PGA tournament. The reasons could include the course has not gained favor with the PGA members or it has no ability to host the fans on/around the course of have the infrastructure (roads in/out or hotels, restaurants, etc.).

I think there are 26 courses locations/complexes in the US and 1 in Canada. There are 36-50 events a year. I'm thinking it would really be hard, if not even possible, to rip some of the tournaments with long, storied histories from the communities, charities, and traditions in which they are entrenched.

I like that you are thinking of some drastic alternatives that would turn the good old boy network inside out.

One solution I'd like to see is the board of the USGA be mandated to have a seat on the board for Presidents of local golf associations regardless if the members are from private clubs or local municipals. It's time the little guys have a voice again.

Subsonic

Eguller Look at how the fairways are rolled. None of us get rollout like that...

Rolling back the equipment will make the game harder and less enjoyable. The USGA is all about "Growing the Game". Rolling back the equipment will not help.

Subsonic

Weirfan From your posts, I think you play competitive golf.

Are you ready to give up 30 to 50 yards on your drives?

The sport is already bifurcated for all practical purposes. I would imagine less than 5% of all non professional golfers play by the letter of the rules.

Make a different set of rules. That would be easy.

Eguller

Subsonic fan From your posts, I think you play competitive golf.

Are you ready to give up 30 to 50 yards on your drives?

The sport is already bifurcated for all practical purposes. I would imagine less than 5% of all non professional golfers play by the letter of the rules.

Make a different set of rules. That would be easy.

The PGA Tour already has their own 'local rules'. It would only apply to their tourneys under that guise.

Weirfan

Subsonic

I am 59 so that has pretty much already happened.

I do play competitive golf but on an Amateur tour and in 2 man scrambles so I shouldn't be impacted at all with a tour only ball ( or other changes)for pros only

I don't even see the LPGA and Senior Tours necessarily even having to to be rolled back, probably just the Elite level men's tours and maybe College Mens.

garyt1957

Subsonic Are you ready to give up 30 to 50 yards on your drives?

I don't think average guys would lose that much. I imagine it'd be more like 10% , so 22 yards on a 220 yard drive. Which would still make things really difficult. I doubt I'd follow the new guidelines. Although I do play tournaments, but maybe it would be time to give it up.
I imagine there'd be a lot of lobbying from The TM's and Cally's of the world who would be darn near out of business if they can't advertise 17 more yards. Not sure how much influence they have or how much they can buy.
Still seems the ball would be the easier avenue if they're dead set on this.

sdandrea1

I hit the ball as far as I can. Don't mess with my status quo.

Eguller

sdandrea1 I hit the ball as far as I can. Don't mess with my status quo.

No one would dare mess with your status quo. 🧐

Par4QC

sdandrea1 I hit the ball as far as I can.

Same here, and no amount of screwing with equipment is gonna stop that ! Wasting their time/thoughts.

Subsonic

Weirfan
I thought they were talking about rolling it back for everyone.

I think the TPC course idea would have some merit.

Weirfan

Subsonic

i dont think so but may have missed that. would make little sense as the problem is only at the upper level in Mens golf.

Honestly, They have been talking about a roll back in the ball for a while but now I think with Bryson hitting 340/350/360 yard drives at will, he has pushed them to the breaking point. They are afraid others will follow him and some are.

I predict They will likely first bring the legal limit length of a driver for PGA events back to 46 inches( The Bryson Rule ). That will take 10 -20 yards or so off him and after that ? Your guess is as good as mine....pro tour only ball would seem to make most sense to me if they wanted to do more.

shokosugi

I think bifurcation is just plain stupid - the only thing you will see is scoring will go down overall - not sure why this matters though. With bifurcation, the difference between bryson and the rest of the field will still be there and the gap between the long and short hitters will still be the same, just the long hitters will be hitting more mid and long iron approaches instead of short irons and wedges and the short hitters will be hitting more long iron and woods approach shots - this should be an even bigger advantage in my opinion to the big hitters.

One more thing bifurcation will do - even stronger lofted clubs in my opinion. The average tour pro hits it hard and high enough that they could play lower lofted irons if needed and they likely will

Subsonic

They are already playing stronger lofted clubs. Standard "Tour Spec" is 2 Degrees strong on loft when you order custom fit clubs.

Let's get back to the integrity of the game and go back to hickories, or gutta percha balls or maybe they could require all pro golfers to have a dicky do like most of the guys at the local muni.

It is already two different games. People that make their living playing golf and everybody else.

Look at Top Golf. Make it fun and the people will come.

Eguller

Subsonic It is already two different games. People that make their living playing golf and everybody else.

Bifurcation by natural selection. We're already there. They'll figure it out at that level and most courses fit the
rest of us.

Weirfan

Subsonic Look at Top Golf. Make it fun and the people will come.

This is happening albeit slowly as traditionalists (translation old crotchety fckers) are resistant and most clubs have those types heading up their committees etc.

Music, family/group parties, many with non golfers are all gaining some steam.

My course plays music outside the clubhouse, at the range and we have equipped our new fleet of carts with bluetooth speakers ...more fun is definitely the direction things should be heading

Subsonic

Eguller I was thinking having the rules as they are for the Pro/Competitive Golfer and a set of simplified rules for the recreational golfer.

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